What do you do when your merchant goes belly up?

<ClubMom_Shawn>	Welcome to the Affiliate Webinar! We're excited to see this crowd here and we'll get started right away.
<ClubMom_Shawn>	Dan Grey, author of ""The Complete Guide to Associate and Affiliate Programs on the Net"", will be moderating ""What do you do when your merchant goes belly up?"" - feel free to ask questions. Welcome, Dan!
<Daniel_Gray>	Thanks, Shawn!
<Daniel_Gray>	So here's the deal ...
<Daniel_Gray>	Cashpile and the US Affiliate folks asked me to participate in this chat
<Daniel_Gray>	and said ""come up with a great topic""
<Daniel_Gray>	so what better topic than the dot bombs
<Daniel_Gray>	:)
<Daniel_Gray>	We can see these going off all around us
<Daniel_Gray>	pets.com
<Daniel_Gray>	furniture.com
<Daniel_Gray>	garden.com
<Daniel_Gray>	the list goes on and on
<Daniel_Gray>	we could never expect everyone to make it
<Daniel_Gray>	this is natural evolution
<Daniel_Gray>	but
<Daniel_Gray>	for the folks that earn their keep with affiliate revenues ...
<Daniel_Gray>	it's a minefield
<Daniel_Gray>	you need to know how to walk through these difficult times
<Daniel_Gray>	how to pick your partners
<Daniel_Gray>	and know when to get out
<Daniel_Gray>	when the gettin's good
<Daniel_Gray>	:)
<Daniel_Gray>	There are a handful of tactics that you can use
<Daniel_Gray>	* don't over expose youself
<Daniel_Gray>	* watch your stats
<Droku>	is there a way to log this chat event?
<Daniel_Gray>	* keep careful records
<Daniel_Gray>	* stay on top of the news ... and ...
<Daniel_Gray>	* always be on the lookout for new partners
<Daniel_Gray>	Here's a question for the room...
<ClubMom_Shawn>	Droku - the chats will be archived
<Daniel_Gray>	Who's been burned by an exploding dot com?
<DropCigarettes_Mark>	I was burnt several times... I think I am still smoldering
<ClubMom_Shawn>	I had a whole site (mommyrx.com) dedicated to PlanetRx - it was tought to see them go!
<Daniel_Gray>	Me too, Shawn
<Daniel_Gray>	They had a kickbutt program
<Daniel_Gray>	one of the absolute best
<Daniel_Gray>	Can you tell us a little more, Mark?
<Contesthound_Bob>	Not yet ... but I expect it to happen.
<jck_ac20>	I've been burnt so many times, I can't get insurance anymore!
<bestbizfit_Michael>	why did PlanetRx go up in smoke?
<ClicktimeBrazil_Alex>	I don't know yet but recently I received a communication from Mediaring quiting the affiliate program. It was my main partnerer.
<Genealogy_LisaDeJong>	What made PlanetRx the best...and then crash?
<Daniel_Gray>	PlanetRX cut *all* their marketing expenses
<DropCigarettes_Mark>	Bestrate International..... They owed me 10k.....it was whittled to 2k
<Focalex_DarrenDeLuca>	I think one of the problems was they over extended them selves
<Daniel_Gray>	They moved from San Francisco to Memphis and lost their Affiliate Manager.
<Focalex_DarrenDeLuca>	That will certainly do it
<Daniel_Gray>	Ouch Mark
<DropCigarettes_Mark>	Appio---- I mailed to 100k database.... I made $100
<jck_ac20>	it seems like they make whatever promises they need to to recruit affiliates, but they are not loyal at all.
<DropCigarettes_Mark>	Both were administered through Commission Junction
<Daniel_Gray>	Lisa, the PlanetRx program paid a percentage of sales, plus a new customer bonus
<Focalex_DarrenDeLuca>	I have noticed a large number of programs that are administered through CJ go under lately
<Genealogy_LisaDeJong>	Ah...what percentage did they pay?
<dreeder3>	Hello all!
<RyanP_GiftCertcom>	alot of programs are going under lately
<Daniel_Gray>	Lisa, they were 15% + $5
<Daniel_Gray>	I think we'll see more and more programs go bust
<Genealogy_LisaDeJong>	New customer bonus...great idea! Was that for every new affilliate?
<Daniel_Gray>	this isn't the end of the world
<Daniel_Gray>	but it's certainly the end of this phase
<RyanP_GiftCertcom>	it is suprising since the affiliate program can be one of the lowest
<RyanP_GiftCertcom>	cost programs for the company
<jck_ac20>	I think a lot of programs are going under because of big, slow brokerage houses like befree
<bestbizfit_Michael>	what is the next phase dan
<Daniel_Gray>	There's plenty of shakeout coming
<ClubMom_Shawn>	jck - why do you think Be Free is to blame?
<dreeder3>	i think programs are going under because they are not bringing in ""enough"" sales
<APmanager_Jeff>	That would be an issue with the product or service
<jck_ac20>	not really ""to blame"" but a significant contributor
<RyanP_GiftCertcom>	managers need to market the program and product. There are a lot of
<Daniel_Gray>	Programs are going under because *companies* are going under
<RyanP_GiftCertcom>	programs that do not do that
<APmanager_Jeff>	Not so much the affiliate program itself
<APmanager_Jeff>	That's right Daniel
<Daniel_Gray>	Does anyone get the i-advertising.com mail list?
<Contesthound_Bob>	Companies are going under because of a bad business model
<dreeder3>	i agree dan, companies are cutting back because they are getting ready to go under
<DropCigarettes_Mark>	Yes
<Daniel_Gray>	Adam Boettinger had a great comment this week
<ClubMom_Shawn>	Exactly, Dan - there are not so many examples of programs folding within exisiting companies, thought there are certainly some (PlanetRx, Amercian Greetings)
<EMT_Andrea>	it's starting to look like a seasonal pattern from the affiliate end
<Daniel_Gray>	he mentioned that a company shutting down it's affiliate program...
<bhoefer>	There are many ""deadwood"" affiliates and merchants that don't know how to make affiliate marketing work
<EMT_Andrea>	programs are ending just as the busy season is upon us
<Daniel_Gray>	is a precursor to the company shutting down (I'm paraphrasing)
<TowelBuddies_josires>	I think that Shawn and Marla are fine examples of affiliate marketing managers and many affiliate programs can learn from them!
<IMC_Ibrahim>	We actually just started one of our programs this busy season...
<EMT_Andrea>	some programs are not shutting down, just 'reorganizing' throughout the christmas season when sales are hig
<EMT_Andrea>	hig=high
<TowelBuddies_josires>	Maybe because they don't feel they need to pay affiliates during this time of year
<APmanager_Jeff>	Andrea...that's bad bussiness
<EMT_Andrea>	some of this looks suspect, I must admit
<Daniel_Gray>	These are indeed interesting times ...
<dreeder3>	how could an affiliate program ""not feel"" like they have to pay?
<Daniel_Gray>	and one of the most interesting aspects of this ...
<Daniel_Gray>	is the folks that leave up their links
<IMC_Ibrahim>	Really, you only pay if they're making you money.
<Daniel_Gray>	the traffic can still flow to a merchant
<Focalex_Ryan>	We've had many affiliates ask for early payment this month
<Daniel_Gray>	even if the program has gone inactive
<IMC_Ibrahim>	And if they're making you money, that's good.
<Daniel_Gray>	the merchant continues to earn
<EMT_Andrea>	they have gotten the year's worth of free advertising on our sites and now can rest on their laurels - not all but some
<bhoefer>	There is a big focus on quality not quantity. Any one can have hundreds of affiliates, but are they going to join in are the partnership of marketing ones products or company
<Marla_ClubMom>	Why don't they take down the links?
<jck_ac20>	Dan, but sometimes you have links on thousands of sites...
<Daniel_Gray>	lots of reasons, Marla
<Daniel_Gray>	they're not paying attention
<Daniel_Gray>	lol
<Focalex_DarrenDeLuca>	exactly
<Marla_ClubMom>	or they don't read their emails!
<EMT_Andrea>	not my point
<dreeder3>	but those programs that ""don't pay attention"" are giving other programs a bad rap
<Daniel_Gray>	yuh huh
<ClicktimeBrazil_Alex>	Daniel as an international affiliate I see that many companies don't even bother to go global and competition in US is growing fast. Why do you think most of the merchants leave this huge market ?
<IMC_Ibrahim>	Alex: Shipping?
<Daniel_Gray>	It's very difficult to deal with international markets, Alex
<RyanP_GiftCertcom>	it becomes hard with the currency exchange to go international
<Daniel_Gray>	There are lots and lots of details
<Focalex_DarrenDeLuca>	part of the problem at least as far as we've noticed ( and we do accept international affiliates) is getting a check to them
<RyanP_GiftCertcom>	it is not as easy as you would assume
<Daniel_Gray>	exactly
<iknowthat_lisa>	are you familiar with programs that pass savings directly to customers; not via cash accrual in an account, but directly on purchases?
<IMC_Ibrahim>	I know a lot of my clients don't want to deal with internation markets over the web. They are afraid of creditcard problems, as well as the high cost of shipping things to any other country (includign canada)
<TowelBuddies_josires>	not to mention customs issues
<Daniel_Gray>	currency issues, tax issues, product shipping issues
<Marla_ClubMom>	Most international affiliates complain because it takes so long for them to get a check.
<APmanager_Jeff>	Some international affiliates need to pay out as much as $15 to get a check cashed
<ClicktimeBrazil_Alex>	And sometimes you lose 30% of the check just to cash it
<Focalex_DarrenDeLuca>	one also has to consider the level of internet regulation in other courtries
<bhoefer>	Commission Junction has an excellent international program...thousands of affiliate and merchants. They control it very well.
<jck_ac20>	there should be a ""paypal"" just for affiliate webmasters!
<ReferIt_BrianFarrell>	just look what france did to yahoo
<Daniel_Gray>	PayPal will ultimately be the solution
<Genealogy_LisaDeJong>	What is PayPal?
<Daniel_Gray>	you gotta check it out, Lisa ... paypal.com
<Cashpile_Josh>	PayPal could definitly help the affiliate industry
<Focalex_DarrenDeLuca>	it is a service that allows payments via email
<ClicktimeBrazil_Alex>	but CJ they stiildont pey anywhere but its definetely a big step ahead of others
<RyanP_GiftCertcom>	you pay them, they handle the international problems...i think
<eBags_Jeff>	PayPal is a program where you can send money to others via a virtual account.
<OmniChoice_Jimmy>	How do affiliates feel about being paid through paypal?
<IMC_Ibrahim>	It's big on ebay.
<Focalex_DarrenDeLuca>	you open an account with them much like a bank account, and can transfer money to other accounts, or recieve payments
<jck_ac20>	it has been reliable so far (paypal)
<DropCigarettes_Mark>	And you get 5dollars referl :-)
<TowelBuddies_josires>	Daniel - what do you think would be a good option for a small retailer (really small) to set up an affiliate program?
<Daniel_Gray>	it's one of the most viral apps on the net
<Cashpile_Josh>	PayPal is very reliable, and usually fast
<Genealogy_LisaDeJong>	PayPal ... would that supercede they payment process through CJ?
<eBags_Jeff>	If affiliates are interested in PayPal, we'll consider it as an option
<ClubMom_Shawn>	same here
<RyanP_GiftCertcom>	I agree
<RedHotSweeps_CDitty>	We have no problem with paypal. Has worked fine for us in the past.
<bestbizfit_Michael>	Dan -what do you mean viral?
<Daniel_Gray>	Josires, Commission Junction is positioned well for the small merchant
<Focalex_DarrenDeLuca>	Towel Buddies... Microsoft offers an affiliate program through their B-Central services that you can start for as little as 500 dollars
<Daniel_Gray>	Michael - Viral means that it spreads like a disease :) in a good way
<TowelBuddies_josires>	It is still an expensive program to start, isn't it?
<emt_shareda>	which is the best program for larger account?
<IMC_Ibrahim>	Darren: they handle the payouts aswell, don't they?
<TowelBuddies_josires>	$500 is a bit out of my budget - I would rather pay affiliates than affiliate programs
<jck_ac20>	cfaffilaite handles large accounts
<EMT_Andrea>	is that also their web site, jck_ac20?
<Daniel_Gray>	you could always try one of the DIY software solutions, Josires
<Focalex_DarrenDeLuca>	well... you only need to deposit 500 in your account to get started... they handle everything from payouts, to fraud to support
<TheShoppersDream>	I have never seen any of the programs that run through B-Central perform well.
<RyanP_GiftCertcom>	you have to invest to make money. Operational costs are part of the game
<Brian_Clark>	josires: be careful of that way of thinking, though
<ClicktimeBrazil_Alex>	I am not complaining in my interest (I am moving to US in january) what I mean is that I am making some money around here but thats only because I study a lot and speak English Those who dont ate left out Is translation such a complex deal?
<Daniel_Gray>	Dead on, Ryan!
<Brian_Clark>	josires: remember, even if you ""homebrew"" a solution, you've got clear staff and integration costs
<Brian_Clark>	josires: (if you're doing your program right)
<TowelBuddies_josires>	I understand about thinking ""small"", but I'm just a little ole mom trying to build my business
<Focalex_DarrenDeLuca>	it would be considerably more expensive to handle an affiliate program in house
<Petrovich1>	has anyone run an affiliate program through microsoft's bcentral or clicktrade system?
<IMC_Ibrahim>	Yes, If you spent 5 hours tweaking an Affiliate Program's code, you may have saved the 500 dollars, but what's your time worth?
<ClubMom_Shawn>	There is a free web-based solution at http://www.freefiliate.com/ that processes payments through PayPal
<Daniel_Gray>	Personally, if I were going to set up a program, I would use one of the service bureaus. :)
<TowelBuddies_josires>	Ibrahim - that's the ticket - my time is even harder to come by!
<IMC_Ibrahim>	Petro: I've looked at both of them, but decided to go with AffiliateZone
<Daniel_Gray>	There's no getting away with *cheap*
<Brian_Clark>	josires: then I'd focus on spending time building a few good partner relations rather than an open to the public affiliate program (which takes a surprising amount of support time, even from a mom & pop)
<jck_ac20>	Dan, why?
<Daniel_Gray>	There are lots of considerations
<Daniel_Gray>	Who cuts the checks
<Daniel_Gray>	Who automates sign up
<TowelBuddies_josires>	What do you mean by partner relations brian?
<APmanager_Jeff>	The problem with cheap is that you get what you pay for
<RyanP_GiftCertcom>	Plus, I would rather spend the money and partner with someone that knows what they are doing instead of guessing what to do
<HerSports_Elizabeth>	Can ya'll slow this down any?
<AYB_Diane>	I agree Jeff
<IMC_Ibrahim>	josi: I started with Affiliate Zone and really coded up a storm around it. By the time I finished everything from the affiliate side, I left the admin section as is. It is a big undertaking.
<ClicktimeBrazil_Alex>	by the way Brian great work with Affiliate Union Its an important and necessary step
<Petrovich1>	i agree with ryan
<Daniel_Gray>	Ahhhh, but Jeff ... when you go cheap ""you get exactly what you didn't pay for"" :)
<Petrovich1>	spend the money and make sure its a company that will survive the .com shakeout
<IMC_Ibrahim>	""Anything free is worth what you pay for it"" within limits. :P
<Brian_Clark>	josires: find a few sites that look like good potential sales channels, and develop relationships with them (ie, invest the tech and staff in a few relationships, rather than a broad program).
<APmanager_Jeff>	That where due diligence counts
<IMC_Ibrahim>	More expensive isn't always better.
<TowelBuddies_josires>	Petrovich - that's the interesting part. Who will survive
<Brian_Clark>	Thanks, Alex :)
<APmanager_Jeff>	Do the research on what you are paying for
<IMC_Ibrahim>	I've seen ""Sleeper"" programs that are really really good.
<APmanager_Jeff>	Research goes a long way
<APmanager_Jeff>	To make the most of you money
<IMC_Ibrahim>	Jeff: Exactly
<jck_ac20>	and consistency
<TowelBuddies_josires>	What sleeper programs, Ibrahim?
<IMC_Ibrahim>	If you haven't looked at all the options, you can make a mistake.
<Brian_Clark>	Daniel: I was wondering what your thoughts are on affiliate programs that pay too high of commissions ... should affiliates be worried that they're cutting into their margins so deeply that they might hasten their own demise?
<DropCigarettes_Mark>	There is no ""best"" solutions..... Each situation is different
<Petrovich1>	my speculation is that CJ and BeFree will survive
<ClicktimeBrazil_Alex>	Brian do you someday there will be serious guidelines to rule all programs considering the merchants and affiliates needs?
<Daniel_Gray>	Those that pay too deep? Well, Brian ...
<Brian_Clark>	not that ""too high"" isn't a relative term ;)
<IMC_Ibrahim>	jos: well, AffiliateZone has a pretty darn good AP. And then for just shopping carts I found a very good program, Hazel from Netsville
<Daniel_Gray>	Look at Pets.com
<AYB_Diane>	who is to say what is ""too deep""
<Focalex_DarrenDeLuca>	Personally... I would be careful when dealing with loss-leaders
<RyanP_GiftCertcom>	remember that with a service provider you are paying for the tech AND the research of people that are on the front lines. Do you really want to take away from your business model to focus on a secondary issue?
<Brian_Clark>	Yes, Daniel ...
<John>	I think that the affiliate problems that pay too much will not be around for long
<Daniel_Gray>	They lost money on everything they shipped (or so it's been said)
<JuniperBank_Jonathan>	If any of you are overwhelmed by the size of this forum please feel free to click on the Juniper Bank link above on the left and chat with us. We'd love to answer any and all questions you may have. Thanks!
<MomsView_FeonaDistle>	What about link share?
<Daniel_Gray>	We'll lose a bit on every sale and make it up on volume!
<AYB_Diane>	how much did pets pay?
<APmanager_Jeff>	Brian...thats where a pay strcuture based on performance is good
<ClubMom_Shawn>	Do any affiliates here equate the backend of a program (CJ, Be Free, in-house, etc.) with the stability of the company?
<APmanager_Jeff>	Pay higher to performing affiliates
<Genealogy_LisaDeJong>	GREAT question Shawn!
<Petrovich1>	linkshare is struggling
<APmanager_Jeff>	Incentive....
<IMC_Ibrahim>	I read a survey (from one of the many affiliate newsletters I get) something like 60% of the decision an affiliate makes on pikcing a program is based on the comission rate.
<Brian_Clark>	Jeff: not necessarily if the company's business model is already burdened by negative gross profits
<TowelBuddies_josires>	In ya'lls opinion is it worth it for me to start an affiliate program to increase traffic or wait until I have built the biz using other sources first?
<amy_freeformom>	I do....
<Petrovich1>	they cannot decide if they want to cancel their IPO or not
<APmanager_Jeff>	Yes...agreed
<Affiliates4Cash_Nanc>	FREE US BANK - a CJ affiliate program - claims to offer a free US bank account for international affiliates. their site is whttp://www.non-us.com/index1.htm
<Contesthound_Bob>	I do too Shawn
<jck_ac20>	start the affilaite program NOW!
<amy_freeformom>	I trust reporting.net and linkshare the most, but really wish they would remove dead programs quicker!
<RyanP_GiftCertcom>	have a strong business model, then look for other ways to grow.
<TheShoppersDream>	SHAWN: I feel that the backend of a program is esential for it's performance. If an affiliate can not communicate with the merchants...then it will fail.
<emt_shareda>	has anyone found discrepancies with payment from cj
<TowelBuddies_josires>	I have access to iMallCentral and they supposedly have an affilitae program built in. any thoughts?
<TMi_RenetiaMcDaniel>	Yes
<Daniel_Gray>	Okay, here's another question for the room ...
<Daniel_Gray>	how many folks have a difficult time
<ClubMom_Shawn>	I think Be Free is pricey, but we wanted what they had to offer and felt like it would take substantially longer to build it in-house
<IMC_Ibrahim>	How do most people pay out? Per Sale/Per Referral?
<Daniel_Gray>	... explaining what they do to their parents? :)
<TeamOn_JamieBirch>	stay away from malls
<emt_shareda>	I agree with Shawn. The merchants need to mbe more actively involved
<RyanP_GiftCertcom>	lol
<DropCigarettes_Mark>	Cj's accounting in my opinion is useless
<TMi_RenetiaMcDaniel>	The reasoning that I received from CJ was that they have two different systems in which they qualify.
<Focalex_DarrenDeLuca>	It's interesting that we've helped monetize more than one new affiliate program
<amy_freeformom>	I agree on CJ
<TowelBuddies_josires>	Why Jamie - if I still have my own domain?
<IMC_Ibrahim>	Daniel: no problem. :P I work with my father as a partner in business. :P He forwards me more stuff than I can read!
<jck_ac20>	LOL! yeah! My Parents don't dig this type thing.. they think its a ""flash in the pan""
<EMT_Andrea>	Renetia - please expound on the two systems, please
<TwoCanToo_Niall>	I'm a parent and have a hard time explaining it to my wife
<Daniel_Gray>	cool beans Ibrahim!
<RedHotSweeps_CDitty>	Not I. Mine is sitting right behind me working her little fingers off. (Supposed to anyway.)
<ClubMom_Shawn>	Two account development managers from CJ will be here at 2 PM (ET) to handle questions directly.
<TheShoppersDream>	to their parents?? LOL...how bout to their spouses?
<Contesthound_Bob>	Dan - oddly my folks who are approaching their mid seventies think this is wonderful opportunity
<SheilaRuth>	Daniel: My Mom is my ""unofficial"" partner. But she still doesn't fully understand the affiliate stuff
<TeamOn_JamieBirch>	My experience is that they get you into long contracts and limit what you can do. They may have prepackeged programs but I haven't seen one worth its salt
<Daniel_Gray>	Ready for a shameless plug?
<Genealogy_LisaDeJong>	Dan, my family all see this as an execellent direction...one that makes a lot of sense in the space
<IMC_Ibrahim>	Dan: go ahead. :P
<Daniel_Gray>	I gave my mom a copy of my affiliate book ....
<Daniel_Gray>	she read it and said
<emt_shareda>	Who monitors if the affiliate programers are being fair?
<RyanP_GiftCertcom>	I have an affiliate that had his mother write the FAQ page becuase she was the most 'qualified to look at the site and have questions.
<Daniel_Gray>	""wow! I really understand this!""
<Daniel_Gray>	:)
<Daniel_Gray>	And she's seventy-something
<Petrovich1>	Dan: how many books have you sold
<APmanager_Jeff>	emt...checkout affiliateunion.com
<XmasAroundWorld2000>	The one thing that bothers me about affiliates is that you have traffic going OFF your site
<Genealogy_LisaDeJong>	Nice work Dan! :)
<IMC_Ibrahim>	heh.
<MegaMags_John>	tell us a bit about your book now, can you download any of this handy information?
<IMC_Ibrahim>	Dan: Your book is in Barnes & Noble?
<RyanP_GiftCertcom>	Xmas - you can frame in the merchant
<Daniel_Gray>	dunno how many copies, Petrovich -- McGraw-Hill is slow in their statements!
<emt_shareda>	thank Jeff
<Brian_Clark>	Thanks for the plug, Jeff :) Stick around at 1PM, I'll be talking more about Affiliate Union.
<Daniel_Gray>	It's everywhere, Ibrahim
<IMC_Ibrahim>	Dan: great, I have a store credit. I'll check it out.
<MomsView_FeonaDistle>	What would be great would be one place to check how all your affliate programs are doing. It is so confusing for one person to keep tabs on everything.
<IMC_Ibrahim>	See if I can't pick up some new coding books too
<Tika>	Gia su webdiva
<Daniel_Gray>	Everyone needs to get a copy for their parent/spouse/aunt or uncle! ;)
<RyanP_GiftCertcom>	Dan - now there is a plug :)
<Genealogy_LisaDeJong>	plug plug :)
<Brian_Clark>	Feona: there are a couple of people working on systems like that out there, that essentially aggregate statistics from multiple programs into one panel.
<Daniel_Gray>	Feona that's a big topic
<APmanager_Jeff>	Okay Daniel.....whats the name of your book
<APmanager_Jeff>	You got me curios
<CouponSnippers_Carol>	have been afk.....Coding books??
<Genealogy_LisaDeJong>	Dan's bio has all the details!
<Brian_Clark>	Feona: look for stuff hitting the market in early 2001 from at least one of them.
<Daniel_Gray>	Jeff, it's ""The Complete Guide to Associate and Affiliate Programs on the Net""
<Ken_Werner>	Brian: do you know of any specific companies?
<APmanager_Jeff>	Thanks daniel
<amy_freeformom>	does anyone know why reporting.net won;t let you view all affiliates at once?
<Daniel_Gray>	I know but I can't say, Ken.
<Brian_Clark>	Ken: http://www.afftrack.com/
<Daniel_Gray>	I sign an NDA a week.
<MegaMags_John>	Will the book help us or just our parents, aunts, uncles, etc?
<IMC_Ibrahim>	Daniel: How important do you rate email? I'm checking out programs that will set up ""sequential mailings"" (where if you sign up, you receive 4 emails spread over 2 weeks, for example)
<Ken_Werner>	ty
<emt_shareda>	what's the largest check anyone received to date from any of their merchants. Just curious to see if affiliate programs are worthwhile.
<APmanager_Jeff>	Uhhh...you can also check out APmanager.com
<Petrovich1>	amy: reporting.net will but it takes a loooooong time to load
<jck_ac20>	ggod quesstion Amy!
<RyanP_GiftCertcom>	it has to do with their focus on the company marketing directly to the affiliae
<Daniel_Gray>	John, it's a good intro/overview...
<Brian_Clark>	*grin* and http://www.apmanager.com/
<Brian_Clark>	(beat me to it, Jeff *grin*)
<Ken_Werner>	ty Jeff
<Daniel_Gray>	Ibrahim, email is essential. total opt-in, tho
<Petrovich1>	amy: you need to go to the tools menu and select ""show all""
<eBags_Jeff>	Be Free is trying to brand the affiliate channel for every merchant. That is why they make you log into each merchant separterly.
<AffiliatePeople_Adam>	Shawn - did you get any response from affiliates in terms of thier ""respect/faith"" in merchants using established backend providers (BeFree, LinkShare, CJ)?
<amy_freeformom>	it takes so lon though.. half the time I have a baby on my lap (like now!) and going to each merchant takes so long I skip a bunch
<Genealogy_LisaDeJong>	we are going to double opt-in for our email lists...
<IMC_Ibrahim>	Dan: of course. :) any suggestions on email tools? Either *nix or Windows?
<APmanager_Jeff>	Thanks for the reciprocial plug Brian [smile]
<ClubMom_Shawn>	Adam - I didn't notice any repsonses
<MomsView_FeonaDistle>	I like Club Mom. They sent me my first check out of everyone! Bargain Dog also.
<Focalex_DarrenDeLuca>	Unix
<Petrovich1>	amy: my mistake , i though you were a merchant
<Genealogy_LisaDeJong>	Shawn...you mentioned using Be
<amy_freeformom>	LOL, that's ok. Just a mom over here. :-)
<TheConnectionClub_LB>	Can anyone tell me what they think about Clicktrade (Microsoft's bCentral program)?
<Genealogy_LisaDeJong>	BeFree...
<Genealogy_LisaDeJong>	because they had a feature you really wanted...
<Genealogy_LisaDeJong>	what was that?
<Petrovich1>	amy: you are right, there is no way to see all your information if you are a BF affiliate
<jck_ac20>	Dan, why don't more affilaite pay weekly, like cfaffiliate? Wouldn't that make us all feel more ""at ease""?
<Daniel_Gray>	I really dig it that Shawn is compiling the top paying programs ....cool idea!
<Daniel_Gray>	:)
<MomsView_FeonaDistle>	What is cfaffiliate?
<IMC_Ibrahim>	Anyone else have a problem with your affiliates never reading all the help documents you put online?
<Focalex_DarrenDeLuca>	jck... because the cost of cutting checks in money and man hours is tremendous
<TwoCanToo_Niall>	complicated
<RyanP_GiftCertcom>	too much money involved. There is a fee for every check that is cut. WOuld get too expensive
<Daniel_Gray>	It costs too much to cut the checks, perhaps, JCK?
<Petrovich1>	Shawn: are these top paying programs by month or quarter
<misty_momshelpmoms>	even just monthly would be nice - and not making you wait 90 days after the end of the month
<jck_ac20>	waitning 30-45 days for a check is maddening sometimes...(hello consumerinfo!)
<EMT_Andrea>	I have a question for the merchants - are affiliate programs right for you or would you consider an offline direct agreement with a merketer?
<ClubMom_Shawn>	Lisa - I liked their whole concept - the private label, merchant-centric angle
<Focalex_DarrenDeLuca>	not to mention that it puts tremendous cash flow pressure on a company
<EMT_Andrea>	merketer=marketer
<jck_ac20>	Do you reallt think it costs too much?
<TeamOn_JamieBirch>	I have a problem with affiliates signing up and not doing anythings
<RyanP_GiftCertcom>	trust me, it would
<amy_freeformom>	pet: I really understand the ""brand name stuff"" but at the same time, it takes so long for those of us who use many programs, let alone many program managers
<ClubMom_Shawn>	Petrovich - the payments are by month (unless noted)
<Adgrafix_Maureen>	So do I Jamie
<IMC_Ibrahim>	Jamie: have that too.
<Brian_Clark>	Jamie: what do you to do educate your affiliates?
<John>	Mr Ink Man!! had one affiliate that has had one monthly check of over $23,000
<IMC_Ibrahim>	I've had affiliates signed up without websites OR email lists... so for that I've created a special template to tell them how to just send the affiliate link to others.
<MomsView_FeonaDistle>	I sign up for alot of merchants I don't use because I might use they.
<Genealogy_LisaDeJong>	AWESOME John!
<Petrovich1>	shawn: i don't think you should mix monthly and quarterly
<EMT_Andrea>	john - what network are you using to track sales?
<Daniel_Gray>	Congrats, John!
<TeamOn_JamieBirch>	Well I just started this program, but we are redesigning our sign up page, monthly newsletter, and correspndance with top perfomring and low performing affiliates
<Contesthound_Bob>	I think part of the problem with affiliates signing up and then not using ...
<John>	CJ
<TMi_RenetiaMcDaniel>	Depending on what promotion I am running, the highest I have ever paid an affiliate was $26,700 for the quarter.
<Contesthound_Bob>	the resources available is simply that there is too much available
<Brian_Clark>	Jamie: that's the key. If you market your programs as ""make money doing nothing"" you'll get nothing in abundance all around.
<Petrovich1>	QUESTION? has anyone used myaffiliateprogram.com as their technology solution?
<Daniel_Gray>	Here's a question for the merchants in the room ...
<IMC_Ibrahim>	ACTION is listening. ;)
<Brian_Clark>	Jamie: education, outreach and development with affiliates that show promise, that's the key
<ClubMom_Shawn>	Most are monthly - the quarterly ones are duly noted -- I didn't want to exclude anybody -- I am a united, not a divider
<TMi_RenetiaMcDaniel>	I haven't heard too much about myaffiliateprogram.com
<amy_freeformom>	I sign up and then don't use if they don't have a good selection of links and banners, they are outdated, or they don't point to different areas of the site
<DomainDirect_Bessy>	Petrovich - YES
<Daniel_Gray>	What percentage of affiliates sign up, but never add a link?
<TMi_RenetiaMcDaniel>	Is it working?
<EMT_Andrea>	renetia - what network do you use?
<eBags_Jeff>	eBags.com cuts checks on a monthly basis.
<RyanP_GiftCertcom>	85%+
<TMi_RenetiaMcDaniel>	Befree
<ClubMom_Shawn>	65% for ClubMom
<AUTOMEGA_Mike>	60
<Brian_Clark>	Daniel: I know merchants that crow about a 20% conversion rate as being great
<Focalex_DarrenDeLuca>	Daniel... it is an unfortunately large number... as high as 50%
<jck_ac20>	%90- %95
<iknowthat_lisa>	what kind of research
<IMC_Ibrahim>	Dan: I just started a client's affiliate program, so... after... about 3 weeks, I'd say exactly 50% have not set up a link.
<SurroMoms_Kara>	that many? WOW!
<AtYourBusiness_Diane>	55% for AYB.com
<Genealogy_LisaDeJong>	Dan - we have an average active rate of 35% ...
<IntelliCom_Deb1>	Some new companies are gathering info needed to make themselves a good affiliate. It takes alot of research.
<Focalex_Ryan>	way TOO many! it's so disappointing sometimes :-(
<SheilaRuth>	I have signed up for programs and then discovered AFTER I signed up that it wasn't what I expected
<TeamOn_JamieBirch>	Thank you Brian, that is the generall direction I am going. CJ has not been giving me quality affiliates though. We have a lot of fraud
<Adgrafix_Maureen>	maureen.adgrafix.com can be added to your research.. We've been running our affiliate program for 5 years
<Brian_Clark>	Jamie: fraud is the nasty other side of the equation, isn't it? *sigh*
<AUTOMEGA_Mike>	hello ola
<eBags_Jeff>	How do you compute your ACTIVE affilaite rate?
<TeamOn_JamieBirch>	Yes and one that takes up precious time
<Daniel_Gray>	So the bottom line is that the vast majority of affilaites are actually inactive
<Contesthound_Bob>	I also find that often the merchant reduces the commissions soon after I join
<eBags_Jeff>	Prior month??
<SheilaRuth>	Other reasons for signing up and not adding links are poor support...
<IMC_Ibrahim>	Dan: this is true.
<TMi_RenetiaMcDaniel>	Support is key.
<Genealogy_LisaDeJong>	Yes, sadly...majority are inactive
<Daniel_Gray>	yup yup
<SheilaRuth>	and no individual product links
<TeamOn_JamieBirch>	Either inactive or unqualified
<ClubMom_Shawn>	Brian - do you mean 20% putting the links up or 20% conversion to earn commission?
<MomsView_FeonaDistle>	No support is right.
<CouponSnippers_Carol>	I deal with over 600 affiliate programs. Very often the reason the links are not added (for me) is because it is on my list of things to do. If a merchant emails and reminds....I usually do it when I get the email
<jck_ac20>	inactive or spammers...
<Focalex_DarrenDeLuca>	yes and that is the unfortunate thing... I've seen so many affiliates sign up that I know could make large sums of money with our program never bother to put us up
<RyanP_GiftCertcom>	Either that or start with good intentions but find out that a website is a lot harder than they thought
<AffiliatePeople_Adam>	I was under the impression CJ could detect fraud...?
<Brian_Clark>	20% end up producing at least one sale ... not even making the minimum at that level, I guess.
<DomainDirect_Bessy>	Has anyone experienced fraud with Pay-Per-sale programs? and how did you deal with it?
<Daniel_Gray>	5% of the folks are doing 95% of the biz
<RyanP_GiftCertcom>	EXACTLY DAN
<Brian_Clark>	Daniel, sometimes I fear it's 1%.
<TMi_RenetiaMcDaniel>	I have more inactives with my Linkshare clients than my BeFree clients.
<Daniel_Gray>	:hey, I should write about this stuff
<MomsView_FeonaDistle>	What I would like is sale of the day from the major players I am interested. Sale in one place so I don't have to change my code every day!
<TeamOn_JamieBirch>	Cj does agood job with fraud, but they can't keep an eye on everything
<eBags_Jeff>	Adam--Yes CJ can detect fraud.
<awvcq>	It's important to remind us of key points to help promote your programs
<Daniel_Gray>	I hear ya, Brian
<ClubMom_Shawn>	I've got an article coming this Friday on ClickZ that affiliates ought to enjoy - it's a compilation of about 15 big complaints about affiliate programs (to bring awareness to the merchants)
<IMC_Ibrahim>	heh, I've read that somewhere actually.
<amy_freeformom>	if people are inactive, how many of you contact them? And do they answer? And if not, do you remove them?
<jck_ac20>	dig that!
<IMC_Ibrahim>	Evoy, actually.
<TMi_RenetiaMcDaniel>	My CJ clients are about even
<SheilaRuth>	I don't think you can always blame the affiliates...
<AffiliatePeople_Adam>	thanks Jeff
<Affiliates4Cash_Nanc>	My problem with CJ is one day I have 2-tier affiliates under me - the next day they're gone! CJ says they were cheating. How do I know that's true??
<Genealogy_LisaDeJong>	Looking forward to it Shawn!
<RyanP_GiftCertcom>	One comment, some of the biggest affiliates we have are a hybrid of affiliate and BizDev deals
<SheilaRuth>	If affiliates are inactive, ask yourself why...
<SheilaRuth>	Maybe there is a problem with the program
<Brian_Clark>	Ryan: that's the right approach for success.
<TMi_RenetiaMcDaniel>	You will have to do your own internal audit.
<IMC_Ibrahim>	Sheila: You can't always change the laziness of people.
<emt_shareda>	as affiliates, do you get feedback from people that they have made purchases from your site and then, not get payment?
<Daniel_Gray>	Ryan, that's where it's heading--a hybrid model
<TMi_RenetiaMcDaniel>	Exactly.
<RyanP_GiftCertcom>	I agree
<SheilaRuth>	I just signed up for a program this week...
<Genealogy_LisaDeJong>	Hybrid - ???
<TMi_RenetiaMcDaniel>	Alot of affiliates join, just to be joining.
<misty_momshelpmoms>	oh yes - and stats aren't right at all
<SheilaRuth>	then found out that I couldn't link to individual sections...
<jck_ac20>	can you talk more about the hybrid?
<SheilaRuth>	only to the home page. Then when I asked the merchant...
<Daniel_Gray>	CPM + CPC (or commission)
<RyanP_GiftCertcom>	you cannot operate a straight program, you have to throw BizDev wualities into the mix.
<SheilaRuth>	they said they don't have that type of link
<TMi_RenetiaMcDaniel>	Or, you have other affiliate managers joining just to keep up or beat your promotions
<SheilaRuth>	So I will be on the inactive list for that merchant
<IMC_Ibrahim>	Sheila: Wow. I have capability for it, but It's rather complicated...
<Brian_Clark>	Exactly, Daniel ... especially among sites with desireable audiences.
<SurroMoms_Kara>	If it wasn't for clubmom I would ahve either never know what an affilaite prog is or I wouldn't have understood
<Daniel_Gray>	And it's the desirable audiences that the merchants should worry about
<amy_freeformom>	why do some affiliate managers require W9 and some don't?
<IMC_Ibrahim>	so i'm writing a gateway script so they don't have to type ?aid=number&redirect=http://fullurl.com
<Brian_Clark>	And those kinds of deals require individualized negotiation, ie business development in the classic form.
<SheilaRuth>	It just makes me angry when it is blamed on laziness
<Marla_ClubMom>	That's why we try so hard to educate our affiliates!
<TMi_RenetiaMcDaniel>	The W9 is company regulated.
<MomsView_FeonaDistle>	Right. Club Mom does a great job in educating affliates.
<SurroMoms_Kara>	Marla it was you who e-mailed me. I felt so special :-)
<Genealogy_LisaDeJong>	I agree Sheila...as a Merchant, I take responsibility for our inactive rate!
<TMi_RenetiaMcDaniel>	I agree.
<misty_momshelpmoms>	Sheila: me too - managers need to realize that they are getting paid no matter what - whereas we have to put tons of hours in BEFORE we see a chack
<AtYourBusiness_Diane>	sheila, it's not blamed on laziness, but unresponsiveness
<RyanP_GiftCertcom>	Brian - you are correct
<Contesthound_Bob>	Marla actually telephoned me
<SheilaRuth>	Thanks, Lisa
<IMC_Ibrahim>	Sheila: There are a lot of lazy people out there. If an affiliate isn't trying to make money from their link, there isn't much you can do. Nagging helps.
<TMi_RenetiaMcDaniel>	Clubmom is very interactive and responsive to their affiliates.
<jck_ac20>	I keep getting affilaites who can't (or don't) place the code in their pages. I even offer to do it for them, but they still just ""slack off""... any suggestions on how I can shpow them the value of this?
<AtYourBusiness_Diane>	if i have an affiliate who is inactive, but says the are interested, i leave them alone
<Daniel_Gray>	Lets have a clubmom group hug!
<Daniel_Gray>	:)
<misty_momshelpmoms>	HUGS
<SheilaRuth>	Well, someone a few pages back in this chat used the word laziness
<IMC_Ibrahim>	jck: Maybe send them the finished page?
<MomsView_FeonaDistle>	I actually think club mom is the only one educated its affliates.
<amy_freeformom>	LOL, hugsss
<TMi_RenetiaMcDaniel>	HUGS
<SurroMoms_Kara>	LOL {{{{ClubMom}}}}}
<jck_ac20>	hug!
<RyanP_GiftCertcom>	:))))))))
<IMC_Ibrahim>	jck: In an email? and say ""As of X date, you just upload this and the code is placed!""
<eBags_Jeff>	HUG!
<SheilaRuth>	Yes, ClubMom is great!!!!!!
<amy_freeformom>	I love that club mom has an affiliate e-mail list
<TMi_RenetiaMcDaniel>	If anytihng they do it the best.
<Brian_Clark>	yeah, but merchants are just as much to blame for pushing their programs as ""easy money""
<MyMamaSaid_Kristine>	HUG from me too!
<TMi_RenetiaMcDaniel>	Which is why we are all here.
<amy_freeformom>	its a huge help
<jck_ac20>	I did, Ibrahim, they still just don't upload it... are peolple really that stupid? or is it laziness?
<Daniel_Gray>	Hey Stephanie
<Genealogy_LisaDeJong>	Agreed Brian...
<SheilaRuth>	Sorry I didn't mean to rant
<timming>	hug
<misty_momshelpmoms>	yes - they all say just place this link and make a fortune - yea right
<Partnerprogrammecom>	Hi Dan Stefanie
<IMC_Ibrahim>	Brian: Who's gonna sign up for a program that's listed as ""Lots of hard work and programming""?
<TeamOn_JamieBirch>	So what all does club mom do that is so great
<Daniel_Gray>	:whoops
<Brian_Clark>	... when really it's far more difficult to perform as an affiliate than it is to sell banners on CPM.
<Daniel_Gray>	:)
<Tika>	Is that chat about club mum?
<Brian_Clark>	*grin* You're right Ibrahim ...
<SurroMoms_Kara>	ShawnShawn and Marla....y'all must be very proud of yourselves
<TMi_RenetiaMcDaniel>	They communicate with affiliates like people
<Focalex_DarrenDeLuca>	One of the best things about our program is there is nothing to sell... it is a simple way to monetize your traffic. Come talk to us in Focalex chat and we'll tell you all about it.
<MyMamaSaid_Kristine>	and then they give you dumn links, misty!
<IMC_Ibrahim>	Brian: I say my affiliate program is easy
<ClubMom_Shawn>	Has anybody managed to claim commissions owed to them from a program that was closing?
<IMC_Ibrahim>	and it is
<HerSports_Elizabeth>	the affiliate email list IS a GOOD idea
<IMC_Ibrahim>	IF you have the traffic to support it
<Daniel_Gray>	Shawn, I have and I haven't
<Partnerprogrammecom>	Hows your book selling?
<amy_freeformom>	they are always updating their reporting area - and helping their affiliates
<MomsView_FeonaDistle>	I actually think some affliates make it hard for me to promote them. I could think of ten things they could do to help me. It is like they are throwing money out the window for me and them.
<Brian_Clark>	... but the 1% actually driving sales already know not to believe the pitch, so all you'd be loosing are the ""lazy slackers"".
<TMi_RenetiaMcDaniel>	No
<Daniel_Gray>	Value America paid me
<Daniel_Gray>	Hardware.com didn't
<Petrovich1>	QUESTION: what is this APmanager.com?
<TMi_RenetiaMcDaniel>	Actually eve.com did pay me
<IMC_Ibrahim>	Dan: I think that's a matter of the agreement, don't you?
<CouponSnippers_Carol>	never saw dime one from value america
<Daniel_Gray>	I'm almost even steven with PlanetRx
<TwoCanToo_Niall>	eboodle paid me
<Contesthound_Bob>	What is the recourse we should take if a company goes belly up?
<amy_freeformom>	they keep constant contact wtih their affiliates in many ways, phone calls, e-mail list, private e-mails, mass e-mails... they are just really on top of stff
<AtYourBusiness_Diane>	Feona, I'd be interested in hearing about those 10 things...
<Daniel_Gray>	If a company goes belly up with your money, Bob?
<IMC_Ibrahim>	Bob: Read your affiliate agreement.
<JuniperBank_Jonathan>	Feona,I think you should share some of your frustrations. Programs can only benefit!
<Contesthound_Bob>	yes
<affiliatepromoter_ct>	cfaffiliate.com paid me weekly
<Daniel_Gray>	There aren't too many real choices
<TMi_RenetiaMcDaniel>	Interesting
<jck_ac20>	mortgageselcet owes me thousands!
<Daniel_Gray>	more than likely, you'll get burned
<Genealogy_LisaDeJong>	Shawn...how many folks on your Affiliate Program staff?
<SheilaRuth>	Daniel: What about signs that a merchant is about to go belly up...
<jck_ac20>	and they do nothing!
<affiliatepromoter_ct>	credit.com owes me a bunch of cash.
<Daniel_Gray>	the affiliates will have to get in line with the rest of the creditors, no?
<IntelliCom_Deb1>	Ryan-Gift Certificates-I plan to send you a proposal as soon as we solve the issue of downloading to the kiosks
<MomsView_FeonaDistle>	Number one: Special sales banner which changes daily or very often.
<APmanager_Jeff>	Petrovich...it's a web based affilate program management system
<Marla_ClubMom>	Only 2 Lisa
<TMi_RenetiaMcDaniel>	No communication.
<Focalex_Ryan>	we actually pay affiliates for downtime!
<SheilaRuth>	Should we worry if they haven't updated their affiliate site in a while?
<TMi_RenetiaMcDaniel>	That's the first sign
<SurroMoms_Kara>	can't you get in on their bankruptcy when it's that much? or sue?
<Genealogy_LisaDeJong>	Thanks Marla
<KoolStores_Steve>	yes, I beleive their are our recourse to take if a company doesn't pay,
<MomsView_FeonaDistle>	Number two: Coupon Codes in the Banner!
<Contesthound_Bob>	So what do we do if we have a program that hasn't met the minimum payout and we think is is going downhill
<KoolStores_Steve>	other oops
<John>	how do you pay affiliates for down time??
<APmanager_Jeff>	It helps you organize your affliate programs, link tracking, income management..etc.
<Brian_Clark>	Bob: look for a replacement program :)
<IMC_Ibrahim>	I've had the pleasure of dealing with a company that has been in business for more than 22 years. My company was able to design their website, and then this year their affiliate program. I think it helps to be able to say that someone's been in business for that long. (not to take away from any recent ""internet startups"")
<Daniel_Gray>	Signs that a company is about to go under ...
<Genealogy_LisaDeJong>	Would love to hear how your efforts are broken out...but that is for another topic! :)
<jck_ac20>	but everyone's suing them at once....
<Daniel_Gray>	they end their affilaite program
<Daniel_Gray>	they start spamming
<RKER321>	Shawn, I read somewhere that you personally help your small affiliates, how do you do that?
<jck_ac20>	I feel like a drop in the bucket...
<Daniel_Gray>	they don't return email or phone calls
<Daniel_Gray>	they show up in f*****company.com
<Brian_Clark>	daniel: they start offering 30% off coupons
<Brian_Clark>	*evil grin*
<Marla_ClubMom>	One way we help them is by personally calling them on the phone and giving them suggestions
<TMi_RenetiaMcDaniel>	That's a good idea.
<Net4Music_Olivier>	Shawn, do you have any experience in recruiting europeans affiliates ?
<IMC_Ibrahim>	daniel: f-company.com is really pretty good. But didn't they put themselves up on their site a month or so ago?
<MyMamaSaid_Kristine>	Marla called me!
<MomsView_FeonaDistle>	Number three: Easy linking to different pages.
<Brian_Clark>	Another idea I use, especially for the bigger ones.
<Focalex_Ryan>	during system upgrades, there are sometimes (very infrequent) server problems and our affils. might not get email confirmations...
<ClubMom_Shawn>	I just don't blow anybody off - if they ask for help (no matter who) I give it to them.
<JuniperBank_Jonathan>	Marla, how many affiliates would you say you personally call?
<TeamOn_JamieBirch>	Thank you Marla, that seems like a very effective means.
<Daniel_Gray>	dunno, Ibrahim
<SurroMoms_Kara>	Clubmom is great like htat
<Partnerprogrammecom>	Some do not return emails and phone calls no matter if they go down or not (B&N, Stamps.com)
<RKER321>	Like what type of suggestions.,
<Brian_Clark>	Use a stock tracking service to watch the news about them.
<Contesthound_Bob>	Most merchants don't respond to email
<IMC_Ibrahim>	I do.
<IMC_Ibrahim>	Personally
<Focalex_Ryan>	we've devised a formula to pay affiliates for their work even when we can't register their subscribes
<ClubMom_Shawn>	We haven't actively recrutied outside of the U.S. because our target is U.S. moms
<Brian_Clark>	If the analysts get nervous, or you hear they can't raise money and continue to post losses, get worried.
<IMC_Ibrahim>	Which is a time-hog right now.
<TeamOn_JamieBirch>	I do as wells
<KoolStores_Steve>	that is true, Avon doesn't, nor to they pay
<IMC_Ibrahim>	I'm trying to change it so I can reply using templates more
<Genealogy_LisaDeJong>	Bob...That is one of my biggest ""definates"" to do
<Daniel_Gray>	Which is just about everyone these days, eh Brian?
<IMC_Ibrahim>	because so many of the questions are repeats.
<Partnerprogrammecom>	Shawn - ever thought about expanding international?
<Brian_Clark>	Unfortunately, yeah ... not all, but an aweful lot.
<IMC_Ibrahim>	Brian: what about Amazon? :P
<IMC_Ibrahim>	They haven't turned a profit yet.
<Net4Music_Olivier>	Shawn - Ok. Would you know of any program that could help us target europeans ?
<TMi_RenetiaMcDaniel>	Amazon seems questionable.
<Genealogy_LisaDeJong>	I think it was Shawn who wrote that he checks his emails over the weekends...that makes a BIG difference!
<nano_ryann>	hello Mr. Partnerprogramme- did you say B&N's affiliate program has shut down?
<IMC_Ibrahim>	Does anyone know the numbers on Amazon? Their associate program, I mean
<TwoCanToo_Niall>	or priceline.com
<APmanager_Jeff>	Ibrahim...have you tried adding a forums to your website
<TMi_RenetiaMcDaniel>	They have alot of tiers
<RKER321>	Let's say that I need to increase my traffic what advise do you give.
<Partnerprogrammecom>	Hi Oliver lots of European affiliate programs at Partnerprogramme.com
<APmanager_Jeff>	This would help in the email department
<Daniel_Gray>	Amazon boast over 500K associates
<MyMamaSaid_Kristine>	BN.com is still going
<Contesthound_Bob>	Frankly, this is the biggest criteria for me is communication
<TMi_RenetiaMcDaniel>	The last report in September said that Amazon has 500k+
<JuniperBank_Jonathan>	Affiliate service is a HUGE part of the model! Too bad merchants often overlook that.
<IMC_Ibrahim>	Jeff: Definately. I'm a big users and supporter of the discussion forum
<Marla_ClubMom>	Jonathon, I have called almost 300 affiliates. I want them to know who we are and that we are here to help
<IMC_Ibrahim>	Jeff: I could definately add one to my affiliate section
<Genealogy_LisaDeJong>	Marla, do you call each and every new affiliate?
<allplaza_David_Fish>	Shawn what is your response time once a site request to become an affiliate
<Contesthound_Bob>	That is why I promote clubmom so heavily
<APmanager_Jeff>	This might help in your email dept
<ClubMom_Shawn>	David - we are on auto-approval
<APmanager_Jeff>	You can point quesitons to the formums
<IMC_Ibrahim>	the real question is how many amazon affiliates are actually active.
<JuniperBank_Jonathan>	Marla, are these 300 calls to active, inactive, high performers, small performers?
<APmanager_Jeff>	Users can search for threads regarding their quesitos
<bhoefer>	when all merchants and all affiliates take a vested interst in AF marketing, then many of the kinks will be worked out. Until then..?
<Daniel_Gray>	we can try to apply the same numbers, Ibrahim ... well less than half?
<Marla_ClubMom>	Jonathon, there is no way I can! We usually call the ones that have expressed an interest in getting help.
<IMC_Ibrahim>	Jeff: Yeah, what program do you use?
<JuniperBank_Jonathan>	I agree.
<APmanager_Jeff>	It's a cold fusion based program
<JuniperBank_Jonathan>	Just wondered what your target audience was on the calls.
<MomsView_FeonaDistle>	I wonder if there are any merchants here who respond to their affliates?
<APmanager_Jeff>	you can check it out at cfcode.com
<IMC_Ibrahim>	Dan: I'd imagine about half. Amazon has a broader reach than any of our programs...
<Marla_ClubMom>	The calls are normally to medium-small performers. We have other tactics for our inactive ones
<JuniperBank_Jonathan>	One right here
<Genealogy_LisaDeJong>	I answer EVERY email or phone call...
<IMC_Ibrahim>	They DO sell virtually everything
<Partnerprogrammecom>	feona there are some
<TeamOn_JamieBirch>	I will respond that day!
<Partnerprogrammecom>	e.g. autoweb
<APmanager_Jeff>	There is also another cf based formus...FuseTalk
<Partnerprogrammecom>	e.g. amazon
<Daniel_Gray>	Still, the amazon associates mail list is pretty darn dead
<Daniel_Gray>	not much traffic for a program that large
<Contesthound_Bob>	LisaDe - who hosts your affiliate program
<SheilaRuth>	Yes, Lisa has ansered my email!
<APmanager_Jeff>	Fusetalk is at e-zonemedia.com
<AtYourBusiness_Diane>	Same here Lisa. I'm a fiend for responsiveness
<Red_Hot_Sweeps_CDitty>	What about cfcode.com?
<Focalex_Ryan>	MomsView: We have 2 dedicated affil support staff who respond to all emails, calls, messagboard posts within hours...if not earlier
<bhoefer>	I applaud all who do respond and work closley with there affiliates and visa versa!
<IMC_Ibrahim>	Dan: Yes, but Amazon must be making a lot off of their program.
<Affiliates4Cash_Nanc>	Abyone know - at BeFree how long does it take for any commission to be seen in your reports?
<APmanager_Jeff>	Redhot....the sell a great forums package
<Net4Music_Olivier>	Does anybody have any experience in dealing with non-US affiliates (recruitement, management, languages ...) ?
<allplaza_David_Fish>	right here
<Partnerprogrammecom>	Nanc a view day depending on merchant
<eBags_Jeff>	It takes about 24 hours for sales to appear in reports.
<Arlana>	Amazon makes a lot...they don't pay well tho
<Genealogy_LisaDeJong>	I am the only one supporting our new program...but it's my mission to take care of them!
<AtYourBusiness_Diane>	Nanc, it depends how often the affiliate program send the earning file to BEFREE
<eBags_Jeff>	Uslally within 12 hours
<APmanager_Jeff>	Easy to implement if you know a lttle about coldfusion
<JuniperBank_Jonathan>	Nanc - It usually takes 24 hours
<Marla_ClubMom>	I just think it's important to treat your affiliates like your partners. You just treat them like anyone else you do business with!
<Adgrafix_Maureen>	Yes.. Adgrafix has Affiliates world wide
<ClubMom_Shawn>	Nanc - For ours - which are based on registrations, not sales, it's generally about 8 hours after we FTP it (1 am)
<AtYourBusiness_Diane>	then payment must clear in the BEFREE system before a check is cut (if BEFREE is cutting the checks)
<SheilaRuth>	Thanks, Marla!
<Adgrafix_Maureen>	I also have Internation Office Managers.. who speak English.. so it makes translation so easy
<IMC_Ibrahim>	Oliver: The affiliates aren't a problem, I have a few in my program. The time zone creates delays, but he is a fine affiliate.
<Net4Music_Olivier>	Hi Maureen, what kind of solution are you using ?
<IMC_Ibrahim>	Frankly, if they don't speak English, they're pretty much up the river with me.
<Red_Hot_Sweeps_CDitty>	APManager_Jeff - Take a look at vbulletin.com also. Good php forum program.
<jck_ac20>	but befree loses voucher ecery other month!
<IMC_Ibrahim>	I wouldn't trust Babelfish for serious communication
<AtYourBusiness_Diane>	jck...they LOOSE vouchers?
<APmanager_Jeff>	Thanks red hot.....might check it out
<ClubMom_Shawn>	jck - what do you mean that Be Free loses vouchers?
<Brian_Clark>	Babelfish is horribly funny, it's so bad :)
<Adgrafix_Maureen>	Adgrafix is a web hosting company who offers up to 30% commissions on servers sold
<jck_ac20>	yes!
<MainshipSystems_DS>	I have has problems with two bfree merchants - they tracked the clicks, but not the sales, and didn't credit me with the commissions. What recourse do I have, if any?
<Arlana>	Babelfish is pretty much useless...I'm German andused it just to see how it translates *shudder*
<AtYourBusiness_Diane>	jck, did you experience this?
<jck_ac20>	they lose the voucher from the merchant and have to reprocess before they cut the checks
<IMC_Ibrahim>	Btw, Postcast is a GREAT program for email list managing. It does message rules and can send personalized emails (all the data is an an access DB)
<SheilaRuth>	Hi, Cathy!
<Adgrafix_Maureen>	I've used Babblefish as well.. I don't care for it..
<IMC_Ibrahim>	If anyone wants to check it out, it's at: http://www.postcast.com/?id=imcdigital
<PreKSmarties_Cathy>	Hi Sheila!
<jck_ac20>	yes! twice!
<IMC_Ibrahim>	Maureen: it's not very accurate anyway
<Genealogy_LisaDeJong>	Dan, any more indicators of up and coming dot bombs? As a Merchant, I want my Affiliates to know we are solid!
<ClubMom_Shawn>	jck - I'm not sure what the problem is there - I do our vouchers and there hasn't been a problem with us
<Arlana>	anyone get their FreeShop checks yet? I haven't been paid since they switched to BeFree
<allplaza_David_Fish>	we are a merchant who answers right away
<Daniel_Gray>	here's a link for you, Lisa ... from USAToday:
<ClubMom_Shawn>	We're going to be wrapping up this chat.
<ClubMom_Shawn>	Thank you to Dan Gray for presenting ""What do you do when your merchant goes belly up?"" We will be taking a brief intermission at this time to set up for the next speaker. Now is a perfect opportunity to visit the exhibitors.
<Net4Music_Olivier>	Arlana - do you know of any german speaking affiliate solution ?
<Daniel_Gray>	http://www.usatoday.com/life/cyber/invest/ina394.htm
<Adgrafix_Maureen>	I have interaction with our Account Executives every day...
<Partnerprogrammecom>	oliver affili.net
<Partnerprogrammecom>	oliver vitrado.de
<Arlana>	haven't checked into it...payment from Overseas can be problematic
<jck_ac20>	thanks Daniel Gray!
<ClubMom_Shawn>	The next chat (Brian Clark - Affiliate Union) will begin in about 5 minutes.
<Daniel_Gray>	Many thanks to all for having me
<Net4Music_Olivier>	thanks partnerprogrammcom
<Contesthound_Bob>	Thanks Daniel
<Partnerprogrammecom>	oliver tradedoubler
<AffiliatePeople_Adam>	thanks Dan!!
<Daniel_Gray>	It's been hectic and fun
<affiliatepromoter_ct>	Thank you Daniel
<Daniel_Gray>	:)
<MegaMags_John>	Thanks!
<APmanager_Jeff>	Thanks Daniel!
<SheilaRuth>	Thanks, Daniel and Shawn!
<IMC_Ibrahim>	Thanks Dan!
<Marla_ClubMom>	Thanks Dan!
<SurroMoms_Kara>	Thank you Shawn
<Genealogy_LisaDeJong>	.........THANK YOU DAN!
<IntelliCom_Deb1>	Thank you Daniel
<RyanP_GiftCertcom>	thanks
<Ken_Werner>	ty Shawn
<TwoCanToo_Niall>	thanks
<APmanager_Jeff>	Thanks Shawn!
<Adgrafix_Maureen>	Thanks Daniel.. look forward to checking out your book
<SurroMoms_Kara>	and Daniel
<eBags_Jeff>	Thank you DAn. Is there any way to slow this down? and thanks Swawn.
<HBWPNetwork_Cathryn>	Thanks!
<Net4Music_Olivier>	Thank you shawn
<Partnerprogrammecom>	byebye
<Daniel_Gray>	Remember, ""The Complete Guide to Associate and Affiliate Programs on the Net"" for everyone on your holiday list! ;)
<APmanager_Jeff>	Im gonna have to get that book daniel....for my wife
<iknowthat_lisa>	thanks!
<jck_ac20>	dan, sell your book at theinsidersguides.com!
<ClubMom_Shawn>	The exhibitors are above and below the chat - stop in and say hello and ask questions.